One-man Helper handle removal?

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frizzen
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One-man Helper handle removal?

Post by frizzen » February 27th, 2021, 10:47 am

Are there any tricks to removing a stuck Aux handle from a one man saw?

I picked up a painted but apparently low use (Disston?) Warranted Superior perferated lance tooth 4' D-handle with a helper handle on top. I can unbolt the handle at the crosspin yoke over the blade, but can't get the handle to rotate to tighten/loosen clamping against the blade.

Right now it's been getting a couple shots of 'PB Blaster', may even try some Kroil soon. But are there any tricks or techniques you guys find to be very effective?
Let's go cut some happy little trees over here. Then we'll plant two, because everybody needs a friend.

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sumnergeo
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Re: One-man Helper handle removal?

Post by sumnergeo » February 27th, 2021, 12:23 pm

Careful not to overtorque the handle so that it bends or cracks the saw steel at the hole in the saw plate!

The nut inside the handle is frozen and it is behind the ferrule so hard to get any loosening oils to it. Heating the bolt might help but, you need to protect the saw from the heat. You could file off the head of the pin, if it is that type of handle, and drive out the pin to free the handle from the saw. Once you have the handle off the saw and can clamp things in a vise to torque, squirt more loosening oil into the opening at the bottom of the handle, etc.

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PATCsawyer
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Re: One-man Helper handle removal?

Post by PATCsawyer » February 28th, 2021, 10:51 am

Your problem is with a rusty internal nut and not the little bolt pin, yes? It sounds like you're doing the right thing, putting penetrating oil on the bolt shaft and letting it run down into the nut. When I do this I first remove the handle from the saw and soak/spray the nut, leaving it overnight. Then I clamp the slotted shaft tightly in my bench vise, get a good grip on the handle, and try to tighten and loosen in different directions hoping to break it free. That usually works. If you muscle it too hard, you'll damage the lower end of the wooden handle

frizzen
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Re: One-man Helper handle removal?

Post by frizzen » February 28th, 2021, 12:02 pm

Thanks guys,

Yes. The handles internal threading to pull the handle tight to top of blade is seized up.
I'm having no problems removing the crosspin (bolt/nut?) holding the handle to the blade.

Cool, I'd figured like most things it's mostly just a waiting game of oils, little tappy taps, wiggle tighter/looser...
I wasn't sure if a *little* heat would be likely to damage the wooden part, or whatever holds the nut in there.

But it looks like if anybody still had some old secret tricks, it'd probably be this group.
Let's go cut some happy little trees over here. Then we'll plant two, because everybody needs a friend.

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sumnergeo
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Re: One-man Helper handle removal?

Post by sumnergeo » February 28th, 2021, 1:38 pm

If you can slide the ferrule off the handle, you should be able to see the nut and put the penetrating oil right on the threads. If you can the hardware working, the job is done!

I've made a number of the wooden handles, from turned on a lathe to exactly match the original to octagonal shapes to ones carved in the field with axe and knife. Always makes for a good story!

Here's one of my turned ones.
IMG_3133.JPG

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PATCsawyer
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Re: One-man Helper handle removal?

Post by PATCsawyer » March 1st, 2021, 2:24 am

I don't have a lathe so my auxiliary handles are a bit cruder. Sometimes I'll use a cut up dowel or broken shovel handle, other times just a seasoned branch. I have a big drawer full of cut up dry hickory branches that are just the right diameter, though each one is a bit unique.

Making a single handle is a labor of love but if you get into production mode, you can knock them out on a much better time per piece schedule. When my stock runs low I'll do a dozen or so at once, and having a good drill press to bore a long straight hole is definitely a plus. I put my nut much higher up in the handle than with traditional auxiliary handles and dispense with the collar. A little wood epoxy fills the hole and sands smooth.

All the hardware in the pic is new, but I've repurposed many a bolt from old handles that were damaged beyond repair.

fullsizeoutput_1a75.jpeg

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sumnergeo
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Re: One-man Helper handle removal?

Post by sumnergeo » March 1st, 2021, 9:08 am

Nice work!

I found one picture of some home made handles that I'll attach. I try to use the original hardware but not always possible. I've even had new threads welded onto the flange and pin so I could use the hardware that attaches to the saw. I've also used stove bolts, cut off the head, slot the bolt and drilled holes to accept a pin.
PB243503.JPG
replacement handle.jpg
P8104622.JPG
new_handle_apart.JPG

frizzen
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LocationCOLON Indiana

Re: One-man Helper handle removal?

Post by frizzen » March 3rd, 2021, 2:40 am

Thanks for the inside views, that helps see how it should work

Those are a bunch of really nice looking handles, what are you using for the new hardware to build those up?

Also what kind of rivet or pins are you using to replace the one that goes through the saw blade?
Let's go cut some happy little trees over here. Then we'll plant two, because everybody needs a friend.

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PATCsawyer
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Re: One-man Helper handle removal?

Post by PATCsawyer » March 3rd, 2021, 4:42 am

There's a guy on eBay who sells bolts for one man saws. I usually buy a couple dozen at a time. They don't come with pins and that's OK with me, as standard pins are too soft an deform with use. I cut the threads off 3/16" grade 8 bolts and use the shanks for pins, much tougher steel. You'll also need to drill out one side of the pin hole a little wider to allow the pin to be mushroomed a little. It also helps to continue drilling a little into the other side of the slotted bolt to give that peened end a pocket. Have a drill press?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Cross-Cut-Saw- ... Swv0tVC2gd

P1014075.JPG

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sumnergeo
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Re: One-man Helper handle removal?

Post by sumnergeo » March 3rd, 2021, 2:14 pm

Hi frizzen,

PATCsawyer has the real deal in getting the new hardware.

I go the salvage or stove bolt route. In one of my photos there is a stove bolt with the head cut off and then I slotted the end of the bolt and drilled holes for the pin. Note that square nuts are used for the bolt in the handle.

As for pins, I find them at the hardware store. They might be in the rivet area and not every store has them. I have also used nails, bolts like PATCsawyer and the rounded tang of a file (annealed!). We once used a small phillips screwdriver when we lost a pin and I figure it would be easy to cut up the shaft to make several pins but have never done it. I sometimes worry that a pin of really hard steel might damage the hole in the saw if an overly enthusiastic sawyer really torques the handle. I haven't seen it happen nor have I ever seen a damaged hole in a saw.

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