Handles for Atkins #4 hammer

A forum about crosscut saw filing
underbucker
PostsCOLON 21
JoinedCOLON November 8th, 2011, 9:19 am
LocationCOLON Oregon

Handles for Atkins #4 hammer

Post by underbucker » February 17th, 2017, 1:49 pm

Does anyone have a source for replacement handles for Atkins #4 hammer?

User avatar
Jim_Thode
PostsCOLON 733
JoinedCOLON June 28th, 2012, 9:34 am
LocationCOLON Onalaska, Washington State, USA
CONTACTCOLON

Re: Handles for Atkins #4 hammer

Post by Jim_Thode » February 17th, 2017, 5:55 pm

I've never seen a Akins handle but I bet a ballpeen or machinist hammer handle of the correct size would work fine. They may be a little longer then the original Atkins but they could be cut off.

I see quite a selection of handles at True Value maybe you could visit a store with head in hand and check them out.
Online at:
http://www.truevalue.com//catalog/produ ... 4622122499

Jim
147219378.HbgnbNgG.IMG_7157a.jpg

Trailsawyer
PostsCOLON 89
JoinedCOLON July 1st, 2012, 7:27 am
LocationCOLON SW Washington State

Re: Handles for Atkins #4 hammer

Post by Trailsawyer » February 19th, 2017, 12:13 pm

I replaced a handle in a #4 Atkins a year or so ago, and I think that as Jim suggested, I used 14" ball pein hammer handle that I had to "fit" a little.
I think the eye on the Atkins is a little shorter oval that standard than a 14", and a little wider than a 12 ball pein..... but handles can vary quite a bit!
I think I picked mine up at Parkrose Hardware, but Wilco and Costal both stock handles not to far from your location.
Gary

underbucker
PostsCOLON 21
JoinedCOLON November 8th, 2011, 9:19 am
LocationCOLON Oregon

Re: Handles for Atkins #4 hammer

Post by underbucker » February 22nd, 2017, 5:02 pm

Thanks for responses. Since these hammers are so well regarded, I was thinking of doing a small production run with a few minor changes suggested by Dolly. I will also be using an improved alloy (^ toughness, greater wear resistance).
Attachments
Hammer Assembly View 1.png
3D model
Last edited by 1 on underbucker, edited 0 times in total.

User avatar
Jim_Thode
PostsCOLON 733
JoinedCOLON June 28th, 2012, 9:34 am
LocationCOLON Onalaska, Washington State, USA
CONTACTCOLON

Re: Handles for Atkins #4 hammer

Post by Jim_Thode » February 22nd, 2017, 6:43 pm

David,
If you want to improve on the Atlins #4 here is a suggestion.

If you look at a well used #4 you will likely see a divot on the side of the head toward the handle, like:
Image

The divot is caused buy the head hitting the opposite raker point when swaging, like:
Image

On my hammer I made out of a ball peen I reduced the surface to help reduce the impact on the adjacent point.
Image

Image

Also on a #4 you will note that the side of the head toward the handle is nearly straight. However if there is a dip on that side it would be an improvement over the original.
Image

Jim

underbucker
PostsCOLON 21
JoinedCOLON November 8th, 2011, 9:19 am
LocationCOLON Oregon

Re: Handles for Atkins #4 hammer

Post by underbucker » February 22nd, 2017, 9:27 pm

Jim,
Interesting. When Dolly first spoke to me about reproducing the Atkins #4, the first change she asked for was more clearance under the swaging face. Here is a front view rendering of what I am working on.
Hammer - Front.png
The face is still circular, but I have shaped the bottom of the head much flatter than the original.
I will have prototypes in about three weeks. I can bring one up if you are interested in previewing and critiquing.

User avatar
Jim_Thode
PostsCOLON 733
JoinedCOLON June 28th, 2012, 9:34 am
LocationCOLON Onalaska, Washington State, USA
CONTACTCOLON

Re: Handles for Atkins #4 hammer

Post by Jim_Thode » February 23rd, 2017, 8:16 am

Yes, a straight back would be an improvement. I also think a dip on the back side or even a total concaved back side would be better. With the short handle and the circular motion of the hammer in use a dip or relief on the back side makes sense. In my actual use of my hammer is works very well. The little dip could be easily ground the back side.

Like this:
Hammer - Front edit.jpg
Or even:
Hammer - Front2.jpg
I think I like the first option because it would give more clearance right where it is needed without reducing the weight of the head.

How heavy is your new hammer? I think a little heavier then the #4 would be good. Warren Miller used a 16 oz swaging hammer and my home made "pregnant" hammer is about 17 oz.
Image

Jim

User avatar
brianthehurdler
PostsCOLON 98
JoinedCOLON November 16th, 2012, 11:24 am
LocationCOLON Gloucestershire, UK.
CONTACTCOLON

Re: Handles for Atkins #4 hammer

Post by brianthehurdler » February 24th, 2017, 5:31 am

This is interesting. I've just realised that you're hammering 'the other way round' to me.
When I started, the logical (to me) thing seemed to be to work from above the blade, so that raker, hammer head and handle and my eye could all be in line. If the hammer was going to hit anywhere else it would be on the upper side of the head.
You're all coming at it from holding the hammer-handle alongside, and kind-of below, the blade.
Presumably, you all think that there is an advantage to this? What might it be?
Brian.

User avatar
Jim_Thode
PostsCOLON 733
JoinedCOLON June 28th, 2012, 9:34 am
LocationCOLON Onalaska, Washington State, USA
CONTACTCOLON

Re: Handles for Atkins #4 hammer

Post by Jim_Thode » February 24th, 2017, 8:46 am

brianthehurdler wroteCOLONThis is interesting. I've just realised that you're hammering 'the other way round' to me.
When I started, the logical (to me) thing seemed to be to work from above the blade, so that raker, hammer head and handle and my eye could all be in line. If the hammer was going to hit anywhere else it would be on the upper side of the head.
You're all coming at it from holding the hammer-handle alongside, and kind-of below, the blade.
Presumably, you all think that there is an advantage to this? What might it be?
Brian.
Brian,
It is kind of what ever works for you. Most vintage saw vises were set too high to strike a raker from above.
Image

An advantage to the higher vise is that the filer has a closer view of the teeth with out bending over. Details are important when filing.

The other thing on swaging seems to be that most swage with the hammer on the near side of the saw but at least one swaged with the hammer on the far side of the saw.

The far side:
Image

The near side:
Image

Jim

underbucker
PostsCOLON 21
JoinedCOLON November 8th, 2011, 9:19 am
LocationCOLON Oregon

Re: Handles for Atkins #4 hammer

Post by underbucker » February 24th, 2017, 9:01 am

Jim,

Weight of new hammer will be identical to Atkins #4. If prototypes test well, I may decide to to second model weighing with 2-3 ounces more.

With the exception of the changes I made to the bottom, shape will remain traditional. Filers can modify the hammerhead in any way they choose with a grinder or other tools as long as they do not overheat the metal.

BUTTON_POST_REPLY