Putting Lead in a saw

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Putting Lead in a saw

Postby BD Rec » November 14th, 2012, 2:28 pm

IMG_0414.JPG
Does anyone put "lead" in a saw anymore? I have been messing with it and was wondering what folks recommend? I just purchased this Anderson #4 (for $3) that had a double pin gauge attached to the bottom. It came set at 10 & 30, I thought that was a bit radical, what do you think? I am looking at cutting doug fir/lodgepole, softwoods.
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Re: Putting Lead in a saw

Postby sumnergeo » November 14th, 2012, 4:27 pm

If you type in 'lead' in the filing forum, you'll see it discussed in a couple of different contexts. Have fun!
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Re: Putting Lead in a saw

Postby BD Rec » November 14th, 2012, 4:32 pm

Thanks! I am new to the forum and haven't read everything yet!
Jeff
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Re: Putting Lead in a saw

Postby Jim_Thode » November 14th, 2012, 6:48 pm

Jeff,
Welcome to the forum.

Here are a couple of past threads on lead:

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=17&p=43&hilit=lead#p43

and:
viewtopic.php?f=21&t=482&p=1282&hilit=lead#p1282

Jim
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Re: Putting Lead in a saw

Postby SalmonCreek » November 14th, 2012, 7:22 pm

Anderson No.4 for $3.00 is a terrific buy!
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Re: Putting Lead in a saw

Postby BD Rec » November 14th, 2012, 7:28 pm

Thanks Jim,
I have been playing with putting "lead" into saws, mostly double bucks for trail use. I will try to put together a photo with specs the way I understand how it works. I am trying to get my brain around this but there are too many ways that I can see this working. The way I have been doing it is figuring the sawyers are equal, less aggressive towards the handles and hungry in the center, easy at the start, heavy in the center, then easy towards the end. This way each side of the raker is set the same, though the depth of the rakers are changing from shallow to deep then back to shallow along the length of the saw.
Hmmm, I'll put together a diagram of what I have been doing, I think I missed the point on Lead.
Thanks, Jeff
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Re: Putting Lead in a saw

Postby David's Crosscuts » November 14th, 2012, 7:39 pm

Welcome to the forum. That tool is actually the Anderson No 9, a combination of the no 4 raker gauge and the the no 7 checking gauge. Really cool tool first one Ive seen a picture of.
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Re: Putting Lead in a saw

Postby Jim_Thode » November 14th, 2012, 8:16 pm

Jeff,
I think I understand that you are varying the height of the rakers in relation to the cutters so that it will make a deeper cut near the center of the saw and a shallower cut near the ends. It is my understanding that the height of the rakers is controlled by the amount of spring back from the wood past the cutters. I don't think the height in relation to the cutters controls the depth of cut.

I think the depth of the cut is more controlled by the weight of or down pressure on the saw and maybe some by the amount of hook on the rakers and shape of the cutters. Maybe an idea to do what you want would be to put more of a hook on the rakers in the center part of the saw and put less hook or tend toward a straight raker at the ends. At the same time set all the rakers the same height in relation to the cutters. I suppose that the more pointed the cutters are, the deeper the cut would be too. Maybe vary the shape of the cutters too. Maybe others have some ideas on what controls the depth of cut and how hard it is to pull/push.

Jim
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Re: Putting Lead in a saw

Postby BD Rec » November 15th, 2012, 7:39 am

Thanks David, that is a 9 on the Anderson Guage! It looks like a blob but that does make sense. Question about it, the ajustment plate in the center between the filing plates, like on a #4 does is not there. There is a hardened pin that is pressed in, not threaded, that looks like they have been using to guide the file. Is that correct? I figured that the screw was broken and the guide plate was missing, but it doesn't appear to be. I have 2 #4s and they are set up a little different.

Jim,
Thanks for the info! You do understand how I have been filing a few saws. They run smoothly and the curl thinkness varies from the raker depth, sometimes whiskers in the center and thin from the ends. Does less swag in the rakers make them harder to pull because of the chisle angle? I filed a bunch of new old stock Bishop saws for the FS and and did not swag the rakers because of the amount of jointing I had to do just to bring the rakers into play. I found them to be "rough" when testing. I am filing them again this year and am going to swag the rakers this time.
Here is a photo of what I have been doing (Photo by Warren Miller)
Jeff
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Raker Depth.jpg
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Re: Putting Lead in a saw

Postby SalmonCreek » November 15th, 2012, 8:35 am

I believe the trailing raker determines the depth of cut. If I understand correctly, on competition saws, the trailing raker on the pull side is lower than the cutting raker, so the cutting raker makes for a more aggressive cut.

Mike
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