Taking set out of teeth

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Taking set out of teeth

Postby SalmonCreek » January 23rd, 2012, 2:29 pm

I recently acquired a nice, 6' bucking saw, with almost unfiled teeth. One problem, most of the teeth are set really wide, like .020 - .025, including one, that has to be a quarter inch out! Is there much chance I will break that tooth taking most of the set back out, and is there a safer way of un-setting teeth than just flattening the tooth out on a steel plate?
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Re: Taking set out of teeth

Postby David's Crosscuts » January 23rd, 2012, 3:29 pm

Wow, I'm glad to see I'm not the only one that ends up with weird stuff.It depends on how the teeth are set that far out. If the teeth are sprung set there is usually small risk of breaking anything by using your flattening anvil and hammer to straighten them. If the teeth are hammer set I usually joint the saw first and get the jointing to were it needs to be. Check the set after jointing and you may be surprised at how much set has been filed away. I personally try not to take out that extreme amount of hammer set for fear of weakening the tooth. i would rather compromise with a jointing and a little higher set , .014 to .017, and the next jointing and sharpening should get you down where you want to be. If they are sprung set I'll hammer them out. This is just my method, hopefully it helps some. Good luck
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Re: Taking set out of teeth

Postby PATCsawyer » January 23rd, 2012, 4:48 pm

Wow, that's some wide set. Were they hammer set? I have carefully hammered out the set on teeth using an big anvil, but when presented with really wide set, I'll hold my hand anvil below the point where the set begins and hammer lightly while moving my anvil higher on the tooth. What I don't want to do is hit it hard with the anvil against the tip. After I've walked my anvil up the tooth, I'll check the set and usually I'll have brought it back to about half the original distance. That's when I'll joint it knowing more set will come out in that process.

Since you (almost) never know how the saw was worked by the previous filer, start with an end tooth and look for impact fractures where the original set bend occurs. If you get a crack, stop and consider heating the teeth. I've seen saws where a good many tooth tips have been chipped off right at that bend mark.

If the teeth were wrested, just pull them back. There hasn't been much discussion here on wresting/honing, but I know that teeth on Tuatahi saws are wrested wide and the set is back honed to an exact dimension.
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Re: Taking set out of teeth

Postby SalmonCreek » January 25th, 2012, 5:52 pm

Thanks for the input. The really bad tooth, I will try PATCsawyer's method. Good idea when taking that much set out, to take it out a little at a time. The rest of the teeth, I will see after jointing if the tooth sets are something I can live with for awhile. Good to know I can go with more set than what's usually recommended.

Thanks again!
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Re: Taking set out of teeth

Postby SalmonCreek » February 13th, 2012, 9:27 am

As a follow up, I did take most of the set out of the one very bent over tooth. Fortunately, the tooth was sprung set, so I just worked my anvil and hammer up the tooth, taking a little of the set out as I went up. Thanks for all the input, nice to know how to do this correctly.
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Re: Taking set out of teeth

Postby benjaminkansas » April 29th, 2012, 8:42 am

hi my name is Benjamin.I have a saw setting question and dont know where to post it.Please forgive me if this is the wrong place.Im filing a 36 in. one man saw.Champion tooth patern.It had 3 broke teeth when I got it.I jointed it down to a blank to get the teeth back in to the arc.It was hard.I then recut the teeth and rakers.I went through the oder of opperations on this site and Warren Millers manual.When setting the teeth they wouldnt respond to a hand anvil and a hammer.So I put a sledge hammer on the ground for a base and tried tapping the set.well I broke 3 teeth on the saw.I have now jointed the saw again.as before.this time I heat treated the teeth.To a blue or purple.the teeth still wont respond to a hand anvil and hammer.So I hung it up on the wall utill I learn more.If any one can give some advice,I sure would apreciate it.Thank you, Benjamin.
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Re: Taking set out of teeth

Postby PATCsawyer » April 29th, 2012, 10:39 am

???? Were you striking the teeth at an angle? a one-man saw should set pretty easily. Also watch Warren Miller's video version of the manual as it has a lot more detail.

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Re: Taking set out of teeth

Postby benjaminkansas » April 29th, 2012, 1:45 pm

hello PATCsawyer.I have a hard time striking the small teeth correctly.I tried as your you tube instruction showed.this is my 2nd saw.I still need practice shaping my teeth and rakers.I will try and find Waren Millers videos.thank you for the photos and responding.Benjamin.
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Re: Taking set out of teeth

Postby benjaminkansas » April 30th, 2012, 7:14 pm

Tonight I was able to set 6 plain teeth at the heel of the saw.After that the champion teeth begin.I tried the first two.they set a little,but not .012.the teeth are very stiff.I am having to stike them too many times and getting inferior results.tomorrow after work Lord willing I will sand the teeth and heat new color into them.I filed a 6 ft two man saw.champion tooth pattern the ribbon type.It was not hard at all to set.I just need to learn.I am sure many saws start out like this,so I dont want to get stumpped.PATCsawyer I held my anvil as you showed in your photo.It sure helped out.Thank you.my setting hammer is a small ball peen maybey 13oz. with the ball side ground flat to a bit larger than a dime.Is it too light?well Ill report back when I get some results or break a tooth.I was going to learn to swag the rakers on this saw,but not until this is resolved.Benjamin.
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Re: Taking set out of teeth

Postby SalmonCreek » May 1st, 2012, 8:07 am

My way of setting the teeth is embarrassingly slow, but I have found, I try what is recommended, then do what I can do to get the same outcome. For instance, I have horrible accuracy in using a hammer and anvil to set teeth. What I do now, is I have taken a 12" 2"x2", and drilled a hole in one end of it, at an angle. I place the saw on the floor, on a steel plate, with the tooth I want to set, over hanging the steel plate a bit. I center the hole in the 2x2 over the tooth, and using a sawed off bolt through the hole, hammer the end of the bolt. Since everything is held rigid in this manner, only takes a hit or two to set a tooth. Yes, it does take alot more time than someone who uses a hammer and anvil, but it's actually faster for me, as a I process that works, and I don't get frustrated fighting it.

I guess my whole point here is, don't get discouraged if one aspect of the sharpening process gives you fits, as there is as many ways to do something as there is people doing it. I try to figure out what I can do, and how I can do it.
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